I have never peeked over the price wall into the higher end stuff because it genuinely has never occurred to me that my current keyboard+mouse were hindering my productivity. $393.40 shipped is too steep though, for that price I think the ergodox / moonlander is a better option. I’m fine with that. [1] https://www.prohavit.com/products/hv-kb395l-low-profile-mech... Reading through the various switches they offer, it seems the Kailh Silver might be the closest match of what they offer to Apple’s switches, but I sadly am not willing to spend nearly $400 to find out. I bought mine a few months ago, and honestly I have 0 regrets. I'm not a huge fan of it. PS: I'm the founder of the UHK. They increase my typing speed, reduce latency and make long sessions effortless. going from rectangle to a split, going from 75% layout to ~60%, etc. Is this some kind of cultural thing, where nobody in the DIY keyboard space is interested in making such a keyboard, even though there are keyboards marketed as ergonomic with cheap dome switches I don't prefer but still have function keys? The wings on this one seem oddly far to the outsides, for an staggered ortholinear keyboard meant to be used at shoulder width. A solid press is "Media Play/Pause". Coupled with "sticky modifiers" so that they can be tapped instead of being held down to do things like Alt+F4 I don't have any desire to go back to dedicated function keys. On my ergodox, my thumbs can only operate two of the buttons. If you are left handed then it makes as much sense as a fish with a bicycle. So far unplugging and replugging has always fixed it, but it's an annoying feature. ZSA Technology Labs, the makers of the excellent ErgoDox EZ Shine and the Planck EZ today introduced their latest ergonomic keyboard titled The Moonlander Mark 1. One must move their entire right hand (or have a long pinky) to hit it. For me it seems like the fewest amount of keys (64) I can drop to without having to use layers. Press J to jump to the feed. Still, I'd probably give this a try if I needed a new keyboard. Even a little water destroys the membranes inside, so I was like hey, I'll just stock up so I don't have to wait to order. I use the MBP too. 1. Like for example Quefrency (. I don't want this specific keyboard, so it isn't a win for me, but there are surely dozens of folks like me, dozens! The injury in my left thumb may never go away fully, and it’s taken me a really long time to come to peace with that. [1]: https://kinesis-ergo.com/shop/advantage2/. Which one do you choose? If you're interested in this kind of thing, I recommend also checking out the Kinesis Advantage. And yes, the Moonlander looks very interesting! Looks interesting. I'll admit I haven't found myself missing the f keys as much as I thought I would. I do not need changeable keyswitches or an ARM processor in my keyboard. I pretty much only use layers for the function keys. I do plan on making a normal staggered version of this, along with the other 40% in both normal and staggered columnar. My wrists ache badly if I type too much, despite all the adjustments I’ve made over the years. But these are dealbreakers: * Requires me to learn a different finger pattern than the Apple keyboard (even ones with the Fn where "the control should be" are a problem for my muscle memory). A purposed KB IC probably wouldn’t handle split halves. I think this has historical roots in the japanese [1]. * The tilting of the thumb cluster might make that 3rd key accessible to me. I might still choose to build the manuform, but it's nice that there's an option out there with adjustable thumb keys, I've never seen that before and I hope it becomes a trend in the split ergonomic keyboard world. (This comment typed on an Ergodash: https://github.com/omkbd/ErgoDash It would be possible to press the key labelled with the noodle bowl using my thumb, although I'm not in the habit of doing so. I dread to think what keyboard layout crimes go on outside the English speaking world. Kinda wish I hadn't now, this looks much more to my aesthetic taste. Otherwise one guy is currently selling some of his split on reddit's mechmarket. It could use an AVR but you don’t save much and the world is on ARM. I have a memory foam one about 3-4" deep and the width of the keyboard. Maybe the "some time" part is actually around six months of continuous usage instead of about three. Yeah, sounds like a one of the Dactyl Manuform's is in your future. So you could probably go to a local shop and test it. As split keyboards go, there's a lot of different ones developed by the semi-pro community. ZSA Technology Labs, the makers of the excellent ErgoDox EZ Shine and the Planck EZ today introduced their latest ergonomic keyboard titled The Moonlander Mark 1. keyboard.io also recently completed a kickstarter campaign for mass-produced Atreuses and are taking pre-orders for the next run: https://shop.keyboard.io/products/keyboardio-atreus, [2] https://atreus.technomancy.us/i/layout-fn.svg, [3] https://atreus.technomancy.us/i/layout-bonus.svg. I built a Quefrency by them and like it a lot. Having started with very generic ergonomic keyboards, and now progressing to hand built keyboards have taught me that if you are experiencing some sort of tendon, nerve, or joint issues from standard keyboard use, you really need to dive into the deep end and get the most ergonomic thing out there even if $300 for a keyboard, when you can buy one for under $20, sounds incredibly expensive. It has slightly longer travel than the new one, very similar to the pre-butterfly Macbooks. Please keep us posted on your experience with this keyboard - there are zero reviews - so I'm very eager to hear about production quality, and overall experience. But I only find clicky switches acceptable if you're working from home, or have a personal office. The Kinesis does look pretty interesting, I'm doing some research on it. I have an advantage as well, and I've never accidentally hit the arrow keys or any other keys to be honest. This isn't even going into the nightmare that is QWERTY. Also keycap set makers generally just include one of every key. The rubber sheet can hand-washed in seconds in the sink with some soap and water. They do these awful design decisions on far too many of their keyboards. I liked my Keyboardio Model 1 but the Advantage2 is just more comfortable. [A] https://kinesis-ergo.com/shop/freestyle2-for-pc-us/ Full Review of the Ergodox EZ Full Review of the Dygma Raise. Again there is some massive backslash key instead of an ISO UK keyboard in all its glory. I may forget about this thread, but feel free to reach us via https://UltimateHackingKeyboard.com/. My first decent keyboard was the Ergodox EZ, almost a year later I got a Dygma Raise. The Kinesis Advantage is the gold standard here. The same could be said about most extra features on this ZSA Moonlander board overall, although I think there's some utility in being able to leverage the non-essential keys when it's convenient, especially when it costs that much. It's got two independent halves that you can angle how you want, and put at actual shoulder width apart. Also be careful to not loose the wireless dongle as the keyboard becomes a brick without it. I would definitely recommend getting a QMK split keyboard with extra keys, I love mine, but I would advise that people get a staggered one to avoid having to learn to type again from scratch. I transitioned over to the ergo k680, and have really enjoyed it. I’m also a fan of low actuation force and short travel keyboards. I started out with an Atreus42 in 2016 and really loved it, so I totally get that outer columns are superfluous in most circumstances. I think it's best in a tray, although some trays may not be tall enough for it. Next, I discovered there were numerous choices to make about the exact Ergodox EZ was was going to order. I went from the MS Natural Ergonomic Keyboard 4000 (which I used for years and loved) to the Freestyle Pro (same layout, but with mechanical switches and programmability) and it made a huge difference in my posture and shoulder tension. Those far keys are usually triggered by your weakest fingers -- return, for example, is triggered via your pinky and can often require you to stretch your pinky (and ulnar nerve) in unergonomic ways, leading to Cubital Tunnel Syndrome. What separates this from Ergodox or Keyboardio? I had a great surprise with the - haha - Raspberry Pi keyboard. Split keyboards are really popular amongst the Japanese mechanical keyboard scene for some reason. I used to be in your boat, not thinking I'd ever want something smaller then maybe a 75% or ten keyless. The rest have some US keys with UK labels on. Advantages of Moonlander. Is there a chance of trying these out without spending this kind of money? In terms of the tall versus short keys... Look for one that you can get/build with either Kailh low profile "chocs" or their even lower profile "choc mini" switches. It definitely takes an adjustment period but my RSI definitely thinks its worth it! Particularly annoying when there's such a wide range of non-split keyboards with nice keyswitches. My first decent keyboard was the Ergodox EZ, almost a year later I got a Dygma Raise. But in order to take advantage of the stagger, I have to keep my wrists at the same angle of the plate, and if I keep my wrists at that same angle then my thumbs have to hit the keys with their side and tuck to the side of my palm like a trex because there's not as much space between the thumb and the keys. * okay, maybe there is an exact amount in terms of how much money you can no longer make through typing ability that is lost, but my point is there is an intrinsic value to having fully functional hands. Both of them break tons of muscle memory, and for no real benefit IMO. … (+1 for the DM! Add a couple of USB ports, and it would be nearly perfect. Had to go back to Cherry switches, but I would love some CYO Topre switches to throw in there. It can take several days before the last bits of moisture stop interfering with the membrane contacts. Keyboards are nice and in many cases a far superior input interface compared to a mouse/touchpad but in my opinion it is just a stepping stone towards "the real deal". Next-generation? The ErgoDox EZ, in my opinion, is the most versatile keyboard on the market. The ErgoDox EZ I use in the office is equipped with MX Brown switches, and the layout I came up with after quite a few iterations is a fairly ordinary QWERTZ keymap with an extra layer for German … For what it's worth, I don't find the ML switches on my Advantage 2 nor the rubber domes on my Advantage 1 particularly offensive; if you are using the function keys constantly then your viewpoint might differ. It has happened on two of my boards now where the usb connection has become loose. Most reduced ergo keyboards are heavily reliant upon layers to provide access to function keys, media keys, numpad, etc. They are cherry ml switches. Nothing yet mainstream like QMK. I think the kinesis or maltron have the best research on their ergonomics & build quality. You can reprogram, but you can't just add a regular "Y" key on the left and a "T" key on the right that are where they are supposed to be. I find that a good introductory layout to this kind of keyboard is the Kinesis Advantage 2 [1]. What happens is that they take the US board and change a few of the key caps. I would also have preserved the full layout, to prevent having to needlessly retrain some muscle memory, but being able to do things like remap "Tab+hjkl" to "{}[]" is fantastic. An outer column the Logitech keyboards for the PCs I use regularly in case... 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